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WIRED interview: extended 12-inch version

Following the leads of David and Marc, here’s the full transcript of the answers I gave for the WIRED News article via email last week.

As usual, I’d really hoped to play down the goofy “cult” label, but, oh well, I imagine that’s the angle some editor destined the story to have. So it goes.

Still it’s a good piece if it helps a few new folks get it together, and I certainly can’t complain about the exposure (and very considerate deep-linkage).

Thanks for the opportunity, Robert.

  1. When and why did you start getting organised with GTD (were you disorganised?) and what have you found it has done for you personally?
    • I picked up GTD in December, 2003, at a time when I was managing several large web projects.
    • I wouldn’t say I was disorganized so much as just overwhelmed. The constant emails, changes, and disruptions that most people regard as noisome interruptions are the project manager’s stock in trade; it’s his or her job not just to suffer those productivity arrows, but to ensure that every other team member never has to—that they are each exposed to only the most distilled and actionable summary of information needed to do their particular part of the job. Wrangling all that is exhausting, lonely work, and without a mature system in place, it’s a bitch to pull off with any level of success.
    • I think GTD has improved the quality of my work, if for no other reason than it’s helped me get much better at saying “no,” as well as really understanding what’s involved whenever I say “yes.”
    • The concept of the “next action” and the weekly review both also had a big influence on the way I think about what I do.
  2. Why did you start 43Folders, which I notice seems to be about “life hacks” in general and not just GTD?), how popular is it?
    • As far as the popularity of 43 Folders in general? I’m pretty sure my Mom reads it, but I really doubt that the lady who does her hair has ever heard of it.
    • Re: the GTD Angle: Of course, saying that 43 Folders is exclusively about GTD is like saying the Beatles only wrote songs about walruses and submarines. I mean it’s definitely there and it’s been a significant influence on me, but it’s far from being the only thing on the site, and it’s definitely not the only thing on my mind.
    • My real interest is not in what you’ve referred to as the cult-like component of this stuff, but rather on the patterns behind the ideas that GTD has helped to popularize—in particular the idea that our work can be made more manageable just by breaking it into smaller pieces and viewing it in the context of our roles, values, and available time.
    • In my mind, 43 Folders is more generally about the ideas and practices that help people make these sorts of connections based on their own needs and challenges. “What are the tools and ideas that might help me get a handle on things in my life?”
  3. Why have geeks taken to GTD in such an energetic way (am I right in thinking that the book and the phenomenon have enjoyed a popularity surge thanks to web buzz and blogs like yours?) - something to do with processes and control, perhaps? Looks like it’s not just a technological phenomenon, though - what is the software/hardware that is being used for GTD? Any recommendations?
    • My writing partner, Danny O’Brien likes to say that geeks are the canaries in the coalmine for the problems that will eventually affect most “normal” people. For example, geeks had spam before most normal people had ever even heard of AOL. Additionally, the problems of overload and attention deficit that seem to be spreading so rapidly these days have been staples in the geek world since time immemorial. Most geeks would rather die than be bored for five minutes, and that kind of disposition can lead to some odd works habits and some very intriguing problems.
    • GTD provides a logical and sufficiently Byzantine set of practices that many geeks easily get engaged with. Importantly, though, David Allen has—without realizing it, I suspect—put a very consumer-friendly face onto some ideas that have had currency in the geek world for years. A fast example? Check your favorite geek’s home directory, and I’ll bet you, 3-to-2, there’s a file in there called “todo.txt” with several thousand lines of what GTD would refer to as “next actions.” There’s probably a todo list on the back of the Magna Carta if not scrawled onto some cave walls. This is not all brand-new stuff.
    • What makes GTD so appealing to everyone is not that it’s novel—many of its basic tenets are, on reflection, incredibly obvious. Not that this makes it less valuable—sometimes the really obvious stuff is what we’re most likely to miss completely.
  4. Some say this is a new cult, and that the web is looking for its own Martha Stewart or Dr Atkins. What do you make of the participation of all these webby disciples of the GTD teachings and would you nominate yourself or David Allen for the Stewart/Atkins guru position?
    • The reality is far less glamorous or menacing than this unfortunate “cult” label would imply. In my experience, most people are just overwhelmed, and they’re really not sure where to turn to improve things. They have more email than they can respond to, more work than they can finish, and more TV shows on their TiVo than they could ever hope to watch.
    • In many ways, I think some of the GTD stuff is a productivity MacGuffin. All the lists and squirrely systems can only be effective inasmuch as they also lead you to the more important upshot of GTD—that all this crap you’re fielding is ultimately your crap, so it’s up to you to decide what place, if any, it’s going to have in your life. Figuring that out can be a pretty profound moment for people. Was for me, anyhow.
    • The whole “cult” thing seems like an unnecessary media confection to me. It’s not like people are exchanging secret handshakes or selling flowers at the bus station. This is just a bunch of individuals trying to get their shit together to the point where they can spend their time doing the stuff that’s actually meaningful to them. That just seems really sensible to me. Not exactly Manson-level stuff, you know?
    • As far as this “guru” business? I’m not sure the world really needs another z-list celebrity right now, let alone one whose basic schtick consists of “Write stuff down, and then do it.” I’d like to believe that’s a message that doesn’t require the benediction of a photogenic spokesmodel. But if it does, I’m more than happy to let someone else take the job. Being a guru strikes me as a pretty peculiar way to spend your day.

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Señor Pantaloons's picture

Thanks for posting that. ...

Thanks for posting that. I wasn’t very impressed with Wired’s angle. Besides, just because we drink baby blood and plan to escape on a giant index card (non-ruled!) hiding in the tail of Asteroid 245B when it passes in 2 years, it doesn’t make us a “cult”.

JoshD's picture

Personally, I prefer letting the...

Personally, I prefer letting the blood of unbelievers with the razor sharp edge of a manila envelope, and doing a little dance. Then I tag the body with my P-Touch label printer….

You all laugh now, but in 2,000 years when your blogs have been lost in the Great Googlezon Crash and infowar, someone will be using my notecards as toilet paper. And the world will have been made just that little bit better…

Ken's picture

Excellent article. I find...

Excellent article. I find that while GTD is a good start, many have realized that just simply being productive is just as much science as it is art.

Rock's picture

Great article, thanks for posting...

Great article, thanks for posting it.

Mike A.'s picture

When something starts to get...

When something starts to get a”cult-like” status (real or just perceived), it seems to rub my geeky side the wrong way. It might just be the “I liked that band before they were big; now they’re sell-outs” type thing, but there’s something of an inverse relationship between geekiness and popularity—at least in my mind. Seeing everyone jumping on the bandwagon makes me want to jump off.

michael brewster's picture

I'm amazed that the entire...

I’m amazed that the entire interview proceeded without a mention of either the Hipster PDA or Moleskine. Obviously, they’ve missed the cultish potential. Seriously, though, it seems that “project management” is a job sufficiently complex enough to warrant organized measures. Isn’t that the whole point? It seems to me that the “business” world hops from panacea to panacea so flightily that Wired wants to treat GTD as a geeky version of TQM or (insert management method-du-jour here).

I’m merely a geek wannabe, so I like the fact 43F is more broad in scope than GTD. (Full Disclosure- I bought GTD a while ago and haven’t gotten around to reading it yet. I definitely need some help. And now Scott Berkun’s “Project Management” sits accusingly on the nightstand. Perhaps someone can fun one of my projects so I’ll have something to manage?).

cheers- brew

Laura's picture

I really hate the "cult"...

I really hate the “cult” slant of the Wired article. Give me a break. Also, I think your posted answers here are a heck of a lot more interesting than the article.

That said, it’s fun to see GTD and 43F get some press. Merlin, you’ll have to let us know how much traffic you get from the Wired site.

Boing Boing's picture

Merlin Mann of 43 Folders...

Merlin Mann of 43 Folders interview

Merlin Mann was recently interviewed by Wired News about the book Getting Things Done and his weblog, 43 Folders. He posted his complete answers on his blog. My writing partner, Danny O’Brien likes to say that geeks are the canaries in the coalmine for…

KnowAngel's picture

Canarios nas minas Um phrase inescivel...

Canarios nas minas

Um phrase inescivel de Merlin Getting Things Done Mann… [G]eeks are the canaries in the coalmine for the problems that will eventually affect most “normal??? people. For example, geeks had spam before most normal people had ever even heard o…

desparoz On The Go's picture

My reaction to the Wired...

My reaction to the Wired Article on the GTD “Cult” (part 2)

A couple of days ago I posted about the Wired article which discussed GTD, and gives it something of a cult label. As I alluded to in my post, I found the labelling a bit of an attempt at sensationalism.

lifehack.org's picture

David, Marc & Merlin’s Interview...

David, Marc & Merlin’s Interview with Wired on GTD

Robert Andrews has done quite a bit of homework when he was writing his article GTD: A New Cult for the Info Age. He interviewed David Allen, the author of Getting Things Done: The Art of Stress-Free Productivity, Marc Orchant and Merlin Mann with som…

 
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